I have noticed that a lot of people seem increasingly disinclined to tank in a PuG.
I think our guild currently has two people willing to tank if the group doesn’t have at least three guildies in it. Even then, there is a strong preference for an all-guild run.
While I certainly understand the sentiment I no longer feel this way myself.
I am now perfectly happy to tank in a PuG even if no guild members are present.
…
Unless I am on my warrior.
I have been trying to pin down why I have this exception and I think that I have worked it out:
When you don’t have aggro you are basically an off-tank.
Think back to when Naxx was the end-game and dual-spec didn’t exist. There were certain fights where only one tank was needed and so the off-tank would try to be as minimally useless as they could be.
After some testing, I determined my best DPS priority system was this:
- If Sword and Board is up hit Shield Slam
- If you have rage hit Devastate
- Wait for rage
I would swap in as much DPS gear as I could while still staying uncrittable (just in case) and just press those two buttons as often as I could. That was basically all I could do without the rage from incoming attacks.
A lot of tanks subscribe to the “you pull it, you tank it” principle. Given the current gear levels, there are very few fights in heroics where a tank and a healer won’t eventually win even if all the DPS die.
However, if DPS are being uncooperative and AOE before you even look at a pack of mobs, a warrior can get rage-starved and struggle to get back to the point where you have everything hitting you and giving you rage.
Nothing makes you feel like a useless more than trying to pull four mobs off different people when you have no rage.
Now compare that with other classes:
- The blood DK tanking rotation is almost identical to the DPS rotation. Apart from Rune Strike not being available they are not gimped by the fact that things aren’t trying to kill them.
- Paladins lose a little mana regen but with decent gear they aren’t getting healed that much anyway during a 5-man trash pull.
- So long as they have enough rage for a Swipe then bears can generate rage pretty quickly on a pack of mobs.
Add to that the fact that warriors have the weakest AOE threat.
So I have three tanks where I can jump into a group, do what I’m supposed to do and get through the instance. I only minimally have to worry about the healer and I don’t really have to worry about the DPS. If they die of stupidity it’s unlikely to wipe the group so long as I keep things off the healer.
And then I have the warrior where one Recount-obsessed jerk can make every pull a pain.
So for people worried about tanking in a PuG, just focus on your own abilities, let no idiotic behaviour disturb your zen-like calm and hope that you aren’t a warrior.
Excellent advice!
The trick to pulling stuff back to you as a Warrior is to keep Bloodrage off cooldown as much as you can, slap Vigilance on the DPS most likely to jump in one spot and yell “gogogogo”, and taunt one thing at a time. For some reason Challenging Shout just doesn’t cut it for me, so I run up to the idiot pulling aggro and taunt one mob at a time.
The trickle of Rage from one mob beating on me is generally enough to let a Thunderclap+Cleave off, and Revenge lights up in less than three seconds. Once I get the second mob on me, I consider the pull under control. The DPS being dead afterwards is just a bonus I wish I had more often, but Healers are just too kind to let annoying DPS die.
Of course, I just wish people listened when I say “count to three, slowly”. Or at least attacked the marked target. But hey, can’t expect humans to stop being humans, right?
[…] to my un-authorized and previously un-discussed counterpart to Brokentree’s post on Pugging as a Tank. Yes, I’m riding on your coat […]
Yeah, I tried pugging on my warrior tank. It is the most hideous thing… having charge on cooldown , running up to a group of mobs and halfway there the mage starts blizzarding the pack. It is the most frustrating, heart-sinking moment I ever experienced. And it was Halss of Lighting, where you have packs that kick you around and stun you…
I shelved my warrior then and there and rolled a druid.
I still really enjoy the warrior for raid tanking but you do have to do a lot of heroics to get ready for raiding.
When everyone had level 200 gear or less it was a little easier to compete with DPS.
I LOATHE the concept of tanking. I am not a tank at heart, although the idea of them makes me very giddy and so I’ve rolled many.
In all my time I’ve found a few things.
1. My favorite game is “who can pull off me?”
2. My favorite result is “no one, take your bryntroll and shove it.”
3. This is made more glorious by being an Unholy Tank and having anyone mouth off “lol unholy.” Bonus points if they tell you, you CAN’T do it.
So I can see where warriors tend to hate their lives and just seem sad to tank. It’s an exercise in trying to keep aggro with a wonky mechanic that doesn’t work well in the age of “he’s next to something we can kill, we should probably kill it, so he’s not next to it anymore”
warriors always seemed like they had a huge tool kit they could use, and the timers on these gadgets were just too long for the pace we’re at currently.
whatever. Set a hard pace, and you’ll always be the first one to the bad dudes. ;D
Since I wrote this post I’ve rediscovered the joys of warrior tanking:
With that said, I still find the warrior annoying in fights where mobs trickle in, but otherwise I’ve learned to love Glyph of Cleave and abusing my keyboard.
Let them die. Seriously. Give them exactly what they are asking for: a repair bill.
I have 4 tanks and I pug with them all everyday, and I have a simple rule, if you pull it before I do then you tank it. If it kills the dps then I taunt it afterwards to protect the healer, and if the dps manages to kill the mob first he’s at least had a bit of a panic and had to use some cooldowns. Either way he’s learnt a lesson.
Dont let dps walk all over you. They have an easy enough job as it is, they certainly dont get to make our jobs any harder just because they’re selfish meter-obsessed impatient little pricks. You’re the tank, you’re setting the pace of the group, you are the tip of the spear; teach them a lesson.
While I see the appeal of “you yank it you tank it” I can’t actually do it. I prefer to tank the DPS as well if I need to.
Incidentally, I also try my best to heal through stupidity.
“Incidentally, I also try my best to heal through stupidity.”
My version of Judge Judy would disapprove.
The big thing, and this is likely the most important while simultaniously the most difficult part for a new player, is to remember how different each tanking class is in thinking.
I’ve recently dived in to leveling a warrior tank almost exclusively through the PuG random dungeon finder and even though I don’t have Warbringer yet and I tend to face pull, it’s very different from either my druid or my death knight in how I approach the pull.
A Druid approaches the pull with a focus on getting there first, usually by as large a margin as possible, to get an extra GCD or two off in Swipe. Why? Burst threat. We’re terrible at it. If we can get that head start, usually by feral charging ahead and relying on our high EH to keep us okay until the healer catches up, we’ll be fine. Like the warrior, we falter if the mage gets there first. Bears move. Ideally dragging the last mob or two on their backsides to give the DPS something to do while they grab the next pack. High armor and crit-based blocks allow them to do that without getting their face kicked in.
A Blood Death Knight and a Paladin tend to run in and turret. They try to position their DnD/Conc in such a way that it catches all the mobs that might come running past them and then plant their feet. They don’t tend to move, there’s no reason. DKs tend to do smaller packs, they have no real incentive to do big ones and Blood DKs suffer from a general lack of AOE threat options. The lack of a shield block doesn’t effect higher level content but is noticable on farm content.
Paladins want to maintain mana. Whenever a Paladin needs mana he asks himself, “Will I die if I pull more at a time?” The answer is no, you pull more. More incoming heals. More blocks/parries/dodges for Sanct. More mana. Given the strength of their block mechanic and that, they do big, immobile pulls. Pull, pull, plant, tank. Pull, pull, plant, tank.
Warriors are precise, and a bit more spastic. They run in, easily getting ahead of the DPS if they’re paying attention due to charge, hit everything they can with a Cleave then tactically wait. Bam! Thunderclap. Bam! Shockwave. They wanna be well ahead. They rely on their Shield Block CD to keep them safe and they want to be far enough ahead as to have the time to do that tactical stuff. A DPS can screw that up big time, but that’s why the warrior is a different mind set then either the DK or the paladin.
Both druids and warriors, for slightly different reasons, need to be a bit braver. The other two tank classes drop their area spell and can wait for mobs to come to them. The other two have to take a chance, dive in to the frey and start smashing heads in well before anyone else is immediately near by. Don’t wait for the DPS, because they *will* screw it up for you.
You’ve got a rage bar. Think about that mechanic, because it’s one of action. You don’t take a break between pulls to recover runes or drink water, you have rage, you tank, now!
Don’t let pugs get you. You get pugs. Throw up your Vigi on the person most likely to be an aggro problem (and learn how to gauge that!) and then grab the PuG group by the throat, inform it who’s boss and slaughter that instance for having the nerve to get up in your grill. No one determines your pug experience but you. You are the master and ruler of everyone’s experience. Shitty healer? Know your CDs and vote kick when it gets ridiculous. Spazzy DPS? Vigi him and do your thing. Be faster and more spazzy then that guy, cuz you’re more AWESOME then he is. Why? Because you’re a tank, not that cowardly little bastard too scared to strap on a shield and be a man!
Do you hear me!? KILL. EVERYTHING!
Nice run-down on the feel of the various tanking classes. I agree that warriors in particular have to tank quite aggressively.
This is probably why warrior-tanking event-type encounters is a big pain.
[…] Wayward Initiative has some advice for pugging as DPS, and pugging as a tank, […]